Holding and arresting falls while on skis

[Ispoiler]

After some thought and crevasse rescue practice Saturday, I realized how difficult it would be to arrest or catch a fall while roped up. I don't carry my tools or axe while on skis, and I imagine the process would be difficult. I have not played with whippets, but I am considering picking one up for this purpose. Any thoughts?

[astrotech]

Get one. I bought the Grivel Condor, which is a nice piece to have, the pick folds away so you can remove the fear of impaling yourself.

[RR]

I had not thought that a whippet or Condor would be much use for arresting in a speedy fall on the very firm in a steep gully...but that they would great for getting to the top of such a gully.

It's not a lot of weight and they would provide some extra margin of safety...my two cents follow:

get an extra pair, practice a bunch with one pair, hard enough to make them fail or long enough to wear them out...As a result of all that you'll know what to do with and what to expect from your self arresting ski poles.

[PWDR8S]

Those Conders are great for deterring lift line cutting. If they ... just impale them! They'll get the point. ;):p

[Ispoiler]

I am interested in holding a crevasse fall while skinning up or across glacers, skiing a line that requires a belay does not interest me. A whippet type of tool might be the only real option short of clamping an axe to the top of a pole.

[stoneman]

Whippets etc. are not strong enough to hold the shock of a fall into a crevass. Plus, in addition to holding the fall, you still need to get your buddy out of the hole after the fall. This typically entails setting up an anchor - usually your ice axe. If you intend to travel in an area where you need to worry about falling into crevasses, then you'll want to carry an ice axe.

[Ispoiler]

Carrying an ax is just not pratical, we use knots in the rope every 10 ft which will help reduce the impact by digging and hanging up in the lip. As for anchors, I prefer pickets.

[M@]

Went to the library to get "Freedom of the Hills" and get some knowledge on crampon travel - and checked out the 4th edition. Liked the old school illustations etc. I knew I had a book from a year or so ago that I hadn't opened in a while - and guess what - I had the 7th edition sitting on the bookshelf beside the bed all along. D'oh - major senior moment.

Buying the book isn't the same as reading the book.

M@

[pulverschwein]

"Freedom of the Hills" Buying the book isn't the same as reading the book.
Especially that book. It's relatively technical and quite comprehensive; I can't imagine reading it straight through. I consider it a reference book. I think I've got third or fourth ed. which was a fine Christmas gift from my brother after our first real western mountaineering trip on glaciers. He prolly gave it to me mostly to scare the shyte outta Mom:eek: , but it's proven to have many more uses than that one.

[mainwaring]

'spoiler,

what are you looking to do? are you talking about glacier travel on skis/skins where a snow bridge over a crevasse might drag you in? if so, i've never heard of people using their ax instead of poles. seems like your best odds are to rope up with someone and use the buddy system...as in "please pull me out of the crevasse, buddy". i can't imagine whippets would actually arrest a snow bridge collapse...they seem to happen really quickly and i would think anyone would be hard pressed to get an ax, t-tools or a whippet in before they went down.

that said, if you're thinking of having whippets to self arrest during a skinning slide on steep terrain, you might be able to sink in a whippet or two early to stop a slide.

[Ispoiler]

This is for the approach and exit routes (ie spearhead traverse) in late/ early season conditions when bridges are not as strong or exiting/bailing in a white out. Ski spread out weight 6 fold, so if someone was to punch through it would be a massive collapse and I am not sure if there really is a good answer to this issue. Taking ski's off and walking might be the best bet.

The knots are between skiers and we leave enough unknotted rope in a butterfly coil to reach the other skier and rig a z+c drop loop system.