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M@
05-15-2006, 12:05 PM
Was looking at the 2005-2006 incident report and the following comment is pretty important for all of us to know:


This is the third incident this season of glissading with crampons on that resulted in an injury. This is one of the most common yet preventable injuries we see on the mountain. Glissading with crampons should never be attempted. If you want to glissade take the time to remove your crampons.


Basically, don't slide if you're pointy, you'll catch something and the results are usually messy. I mention it becuase we go back and forth on the crampon questions - and this is a very critical piece of it. So from now on if someone asks make sure our answers include "DO NOT GLISSADE WITH CRAMPONS" in there somehow.

Here's the offical webpage of incidents:
http://www.tuckerman.org/accident/Summaries06/otherincidents2006.htm

And here's the three incidents in question from this year:



1-22-2006 The victim was performing a seated glissade with crampons on in Huntington Ravine. Once he moved from soft new snow to the older hard icy surface he lost control and began cartwheeling. He tumbled about 150 to 200 feet before stopping in the rocks. Students from Lyndon State College were in the area and assisted the victim and called 911. The Gorham Ambulance service was called who relayed the information to the Forest Service Snow Rangers. Additional rescue resources were called. The victim was placed in a litter and lowered 600' down the Fan, slid to the Sherburne ski trail where he was placed on the USFS snowcat. Due to icy conditions on the ski trail, the litter was belayed down the two lower hills and slid to a waiting ambulance. The victim suffered three fractured vertebrae, broken ribs, hand and ankle. This rescue took 22 people approximately 4.5 hours to complete.

2-11-2006 The victim was glissading in Tuckerman Ravine while wearing crampons. His crampon caught in the snow and he twisted his ankle. He made his way to Hermit Lake where he sought assistance from Forest Service Snow Rangers. He was transported to Pinkham in the USFS snowcat. This rescue took 1 person 1 hour.

2-25-2006 The vicim was glissading in Tuckerman Ravine while wearing crampons. His crampon caught on the snow and he injured his ankle. His friends assisted him to Hermit Lake where they sought help from Forest Service Snow Rangers. The Snow Rangers assessed his injury and splinted his ankle. He was transported to Pinkham via the USFS snowcat. This rescue took 2 people 1 hour.

Comments:

This is the third incident this season of glissading with crampons on that resulted in an injury. This is one of the most common yet preventable injuries we see on the mountain. Glissading with crampons should never be attempted. If you want to glissade take the time to remove your crampons.


M@

astrotech
05-15-2006, 01:34 PM
Basically, don't slide if you're pointy, you'll catch something and the results are usually messy.


M@

Yup, good catch M@! The Accidents in North American Mountaineering has a few such incidents as well.
Also when you self arrest with an ice axe, one thing that is important is to lift those feet up off the snow and use the axe. Again, the crampon points.

Basically, it comes down to this. Learn how to use your gear properly.

skiyak777
05-15-2006, 02:17 PM
"DO NOT GLISSADE WITH CRAMPONS"
M@

Oh, and the pointy end of your ice axe should go down. (Someone on Shasta fell and skewered their neck last summer because they had theirs upside down!)

elwood
05-15-2006, 02:40 PM
I unintentionally glissaded with crampons last year down right gulley. The entire time the only think I could think of was "keep your feet up". Oh yeah that and, "I'm gonna die!".

Yeah so, anyway... good point M@. Crampons are a great tool, but they can also kill you.

PWDR8S
05-15-2006, 04:13 PM
Yes.... pointy things can be dangerous!

Sledhaulingmedic
05-15-2006, 08:47 PM
I think on a similar theme, you should really consider having your axe in hand, rather than on your pack, if you are walking on anything more than the most gentle of inclines. Sure, odds are you won't mis-step, but if you do, you are likely to be slip slidin' away with pointed sticks, I mean, crampons.

skicdave
05-15-2006, 09:13 PM
I think on a similar theme, you should really consider having your axe in hand, rather than on your pack, if you are walking on anything more than the most gentle of inclines. Sure, odds are you won't mis-step, but if you do, you are likely to be slip slidin' away with pointed sticks, I mean, crampons.

You mean this isn't a good idea? Oh yeah you're right! ;)

http://timefortuckerman.com/apr14-2001/288_-_Snowboarder_Wipeout_-_Watch_That_Ice_Axe!.jpg

Sledhaulingmedic
05-15-2006, 09:42 PM
Somehow, I don't think that's going to heal overnight.

surf88
05-16-2006, 06:22 PM
EMS used to make a pack called the "Expedition Alpine" it was made to safely hold two Ice Axes, and Skis, and everything else you need for a night on the mountain. If you ever see one grab it.

awf170
05-16-2006, 09:37 PM
Stupid question: What the heck is glissading?

DMC
05-16-2006, 10:21 PM
Pretty much running down a slope with an ice axe(no crampons) - dropping and sliding, rolling - getting back up take a few more steps falling - self arresting - rolling - sliding...

It's fun.

skiyak777
05-17-2006, 03:44 AM
Stupid question: What the heck is glissading?

http://timefortuckerman.com/photopost/data/500/1821shasta24-med.jpg

From FOTH:

There are three primary methods of glissading:

Sitting glissade
This is the easiest to learn and generally provides the best feeling of being in control. It also works better in softer snow where the standing glissade would be ineffective. Basically, just sit down and push yourself off holding on to your ice axe in a self-arrest position. Push the spike of the axe into the snow on one side and use it as a rudder to control your speed and prevent your body from overextending forward.

To halt your momentum, dig the spike in deeper and gently dig in your heels—do not do it abruptly or chances are, you will be doing a "heart in mouth" somersault. For an emergency stop, self-arrest.

The major drawback to the sitting glissade is your outer layers getting wet. A good pair of nylon coated rain pants really come in handy.

Standing glissade
The standing glissade is the preferred method if you know how to do it and snow conditions are acceptable. This form allows you a better view of route hazards, provides better maneuverability and cuts down the wet and abrasive forces of the sitting glissade. The standing glissade is best done over firm snow with a soft top layer. Start in a semi-crouched position with the knees moderately bent and your arms spread out for balance. Feet can be together or farther apart as needed but keep one foot slightly ahead of the other to improve stability and prevent nose dives.

To slow down or stop, you can stand up and dig your heels in, crouch and drag your ice axe or turn as if you were downhill skiiing.

Crouching glissade
The crouching glissade is similar to the standing method except the climber sits back and drags the spike of their ice axe (held in self-arrest grip) in the snow. The method is slower but more controlled than the standing glissade.

Cautions
Glissading is quite hazardous and it is very easy to injure oneself if you lose control.
Do not try it without an ice axe; a self-arrest when out of control may save your life.
Only glissade when there is a safe runout -- if you slide out of control, you will not be injured before reaching it.
Do not wear crampons for a sitting glissade as catching a point in the snow is a very likely consequence.
On very hard, compacted snow or heavily icy slopes, consider other options. A self-arrest in such conditions may be impossible.

RR
05-17-2006, 06:57 AM
Nice standing glissade sequence...my son demos how to snow the old man while descending into Val Mesdi on Piz Boe in the Dolomites

http://timefortuckerman.com/photopost/data/500/415Standing_glissade1-med.JPG
http://timefortuckerman.com/photopost/data/500/415Standing_glissade2-med.JPG
http://timefortuckerman.com/photopost/data/500/415Standing_glissade3-med.JPG

NtrentT
05-17-2006, 09:38 AM
cool pics RR !!

Is it me or is there a smaller amount of injuries this season?

Thats a good thing by the way. :D

Skilasnow
05-17-2006, 10:58 AM
Is it me or is there a smaller amount of injuries this season?


MWVSP was overwhelmed with injuries on April22 and needed to call down for additional help. Most of these resulting from cartwheeling down the lip.

There were several other days with multiple injuries as well.

The reports on this page represent a small handful of accidents which were particularly serious in nature. (http://www.tuckerman.org/accident/Summaries06/otherincidents2006.htm)