NEED ADVICE ON NEW AT GEAR

[elwood]

So I'm gonna do it. I'm getting AT skis. (Or Randonee skis for you frenchies :p )

I need some advice on where to go and what to get. I'm quite an agressive Alpine skier, so I would think I want a stiffer AT ski. However, I am working on a budget, and don't want to spend more than say $250 USD for them. I think I am going to splurge and get those new naxo bindings. Boots, I'll get wahtever fits and works with my setup, those will come. But being a VT jungle skiier, I'm gonna need some skis that are versatile, yet cut through the crud. What do you experts suggest?

[elwood]

P.S. I said I didn't want to spend more than 250, but anything cheaper would be even better (Obviously)...

[Jolly J]

I'm tossing the same idea around and am on a budget as well. I was thinking of just buying a pair of AT bindings. I'm likeing the Freerides, but I haven't looked at the naxo yet. My thinking is to throw them on one of my older pairs of skis and just using my regular downhill boots for the time being...Can you do this? Are you absolutly need AT boots as well.

[RR]

Atomic TM22 comes to mind, especially if you can find "new old stock" form 2001 or 2002, they should be in budget.

You could take a look at Mountain Gear Dot Com (http://www.mgear.com/pages/sale/clearance.asp?level2_id=81&level3_id=0&level2_title=Snow+Sports+Clearance&level3_title=Clearance) clearance items.

I just saw some Fischer Big sticks that might do the trick. backcountry store dot com (http://www.backcountrystore.com/store/FIS0001?mv_session_id=NYk8AXiD&mv_pc=289&cat_id=1&subcat_id=3)

[elwood]

RR:
Atomic TM22 comes to mind, especially if you can find "new old stock" form 2001 or 2002, they should be in budget.

You could take a look at Mountain Gear Dot Com (http://www.mgear.com/pages/sale/clearance.asp?level2_id=81&level3_id=0&level2_title=Snow+Sports+Clearance&level3_title=Clearance) clearance items. I was looking at mgear, and saw a couple of pairs in my price range. I saw the Atomic TC-10 Super light and the Karhu Ryder. Those two caught my eye. Any expertise on those specific models?

[RR]

:booboo:

[RR]

The word "Light" and I don't get along. I am affectionately known as "Rob Destroy" by all my team-mates...I bust stuff pretty quick if it's light. Give me sturdy over light every time.

check out the link I added on fome Fischers to my previous post....those would stand up as well as the TM 22's

[NHski]

http://www.bdel.com/php/specials.php?gear=backcountry&id=161

A little bit more $ then want you want to spend, but I love mine. Pretty lightweight (good for uphill), stiff and enough surfice area to float.

I've got these planks on the freeride with the denali xt boots. Its a great set up.

The naxo had gotten good reviews.

[RR]

I found some Tuas in your size: Mito 192cm (http://www.mountainmagic.com/equipment/skiing/bc-section-item/bcskis/tua-mito.htm)

[elwood]

Sounds like those Fischers are just what I need. What is your take on the Tuas? They fit in my price range, are they tough and stiff? I sure as hell don't want some flimsy piece of crap that's gonna break the first time my fat a** takes a turn! :D

[RR]

I ski used junk all the time and have no time on any of the above. But there are a few places to check on gear.

MtnCommunity.org (http://www.mtncommunity.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi) -Click on Backcountry skiing Lots of user infor can be had for the asking...might take a few days, but these folks include some of the worlds best ski mountaineers.

First Tracks (http://www.firsttracksonline.com/welcome.htm) - The user groups are okay

No doubt there are more such out there

[RR]

Found some reviews: Mostly tele related, but both note the AT as being a primary focus for the Mito ski. That structure means AT binders should mount up solid and stay put...very important IMO.
Tuas for tele (http://telemarktips.com/forums/Ski_Reviews/posts/244.html)

Dr Telemark (http://www.telemarktips.com/SkiReview99.html)

Bon Chance!

[RR]

Just in case nobody could tell, I am also looking...can't actually buy, but, hey, I have found some good stuff at good prices :reading:

Here's another: Barrabes (http://www.barrabes.com/barrabes/treedept.asp?dept_id=339&opt=d) - Check out the several listings under "Boards". And, while you are at it, check out the $231US for Scarpa Lasers.

One More spot:
telemark-pyrenees (http://www.telemark-pyrenees.com/e_index.htm) - This stuff is making me crazy!

[jshefftz]

I recently wrote a comprehensive overview of randonnee gear for realskiers.com -- send me e-mail at:
jshefftz [insert "at" sign here] hotmail.com
... if interested in receiving it (two Word files plus an Excel file).
If the e-mail gets bounced back, it's because my hotmail account is under siege from spam w/ large attachments that fill up my account until I delete them, so just try again and eventually it will get through.

[kfarrar]

I love my Hagan's for the price of $110 USD. I bought them from www.thinkmountain.com. (http://www.thinkmountain.com.) I know you can also get them at Mountain Equiptment Coop (www.mec.ca) in Canada. I know they have a store in Toranto and I think they opened on up in Montreal.

[jshefftz]

Other related thoughts:
- Mounting up randonnee bindings on whatever old beat-up alpine mid-fat rock ski you have lying around the basement and then using your alpine downhill boots is a perfectly fine way to start out. Your rig will be heavy, but still more light and versatile than a pure alpine downhill setup.
- The Naxo holds much promise to be a worthy competitor of the Freeride, but the only review thus far is several sentences in the latest issue of Couloir, and that was a pre-production model from last spring. Nobody in the U.S. has yet skied on the final version.
- The Atomic TC-10 Superlight makes for a nice light mountaineering ski, but if you’re used to the performance of alpine downhill skis, you’ll be a bit disappointed.
- The Fischer BigStix 750 on sale at bcstore.com is really just the alpine downhill BigStix 75 from last year, and is a very good midfat ski ... at a really really super price!
- Telemark-pyrenees.com has lots of great close-out specials and excellent customer service. (A typical example: my wife’s boot buckle broke, and absolutely nobody in the U.S. had the exact replacement, even the U.S. distributor. I contact TP, and after profuse apologies concerning my misfortune, then send me e-mails every week letting me know of their continuing efforts to find one. Finally they send me the buckle, free of charge, along with two long-sleeve t-shirts to compensate for the bother. Basically the same story on a binding my brother broke.)
- Barrabes.com established a very bad reputation for customer service a few years ago, but may have reformed itself since then. I have not heard any recent stories.
- IME in N Conway has a large consigment basement w/ lots of AT gear. Also, a great deal on the Garmont GSM over at sierratradingpost.com

[elwood]

Got your email. Thanks for the info! I have a little bit of reading to do before I make my decision. Thanks to all of you who have posted!

[Lftgly]

elwood, just mount those AT bindings on your favorite alpine ski!

Don't get sucked into marketing hype of the manufacturers, ski on the boards you like to ski on. You already skiing out the same terrain on your alpine boards, you don't need different boards, just AT bindings & skins to ski-in. As long as you're alpine skis are mid-fat or wider, you're all set.

Same advice on boots, unless you plan on doing any significant (1 mile plus) amount of hiking in your boots. Just stick with the alpine boots you know that fit. I skied alpine boots with AT bindings for ten years, no problem. I carried the ski boots in my pack on any long hikes, then switched and put the hiking boots in my pack when I reached the snow. The cost is extra pounds in your pack, but you're gonna get higher performance out of the alpine boots than AT boots.

As soon as you switch to AT boots, even with a stiff model & everything locked down & tightened, they are so-o-o-o soft you can't pressure the boot to turn the ski - now it's all in the ankle. You have to stay totally centered - no leaning forward into the boot with your calf. I had to change my skiing dramatically when I finally bought a pair of AT Boots for the occasional situation where a long hike was involved, to shed a few pounds from my pack.

I found the difference so great, that I could not ski my alpine boots at ski areas, then switch to the AT boots for back country. Switching back and forth was too big an adjustment. I had to ski those AT boots every day to be able to turn 'em with confidence when it really mattered most. My beloved Technica boots have gathered dust ever since. Luckily the boot soles of my AT boots are only a couple MM different than my Technicas, so I didn't have to re-adjust all my alpine bindings.

That said, if you're gonna buy AT boots, I've been REAL happy with the Garmont Freeride boots I picked up at IME last year. I got an older liner, which happened to fit well (a big surprise, since I've always had a hard time finding ski boots that fit), but you'll find the newer liner is a heat-up foam model that forms to your foot. One friend didn't know the liner could be heated to fit, and skied the boots a while right out of the box (that's what happens when you buy over the internet!). When he found out, heated them up, and fit 'em, they got even better - he says his liner is great.

If you buy AT boots, get a four-buckle boot! Coming from alpine boots, you'll find anything less offers way too little support.

AT Bindings: If I were you, I'd hesitate to be an early adopter of the new Naxos. Give them a season to work out the bugs, and buy next year's model after the re-design/fortify whatever breaks on everyone this season. You don't want to be the guy holding that wonderful new front-release toe-piece in one hand, trying to figure out how to repair it in the backcountry.

Definitely consider the Fritsche Freeride. It's the result of improving upon a design that has been thoroughly field-tested. I've got the older Diamir II, and I love them. But I know people (taller & heavier than I), who've broken the toe piece 2-3 times. I'm fairly confident in my DiamirIIs, after skiing them all last season, but I plan on upgrading to the Freeride on the next pair of boards.

[jshefftz]

Lftgly, just which AT boot models are you busting on so harshly? (You mention the Garmont Freeride, but not such boot name exists.) I use my Garmont GSM (stiffened with an old Raichle Flexon tongue and an extra set of power straps) for backcountry, my alpine race boots for lift-served racing, and a mixture of both for other lift-served skiing. I’ve never had any problems switching back and forth between them, even on the same weekend. (And ditto for when I had the old Rossignol Raid, which even though heavily modified was still very soft.)
I agree that alpine downhill skis work fine w/ randonnee bindings, but some of those skis can be on the heavy side.
Also note that the Diamir III has essentially the same toe & heel unit plastic housings as the Freeride (this is the only difference between the II and III), with the relatively insignificant difference of a slightly modified toe unit housing, so the only reason to get the Freeride is the 12 (instead of 10) max release setting (not durability).

[M@]

How hard is it to hike/skin with alpine boots?
(term maybe wrong, I mean with ALPINE/HARD boots, I want to know how hard to HIKE with the heel in your new AT bindings unlatched)

[kfarrar]

It not hard, it just requires more effort. If you are in good shape = no big deal, if you are not = work.

With that said, most people I have met will endure quite a bit of strain to make it up to Tucks. Given that the worst you can do is hike in with boots and skis strapped to you pack, any piece of equiptment you can wear is going to produce less strain = more fun skiing.

Just a different way of looking at it.

[RR]

Ditto that, I hit the switch on my heavy old in-bounds Lange's and trekking isn't all that bad in the Silvretta's.

I figure that the Scarpa Denali's are about 1.5 pounds lighter and just as stiff (if not stiffer) as my aged Lange's. On a long tour, that's gonna add up to a really worthwhile saving. Scarpa Laser's will save me even more sweat, but I'm a lot closer to maxing their capabilities than the Denali's....fortunately, at 52 I'm unlikely to get stronger and I'm too active to let myself get much heavier.