tux waterfall hole accident

[natron]

http://tuckerman.org/weekend.asp

[icelanticskier]

april. anyone want some popcorn? let the show begin.................:rolleyes:

rog

[djming]

Just read the report now. Certainly is one lucky dude. That's one "wake up call" I don't wish on anyone.
Hopefully all those involved (his friends, those that helped out and anybody else who saw it) take away some valuable info from this.
Really thoughtful write up by ranger.

[Locotiki]

Just read the report now. Certainly is one lucky dude. That's one "wake up call" I don't wish on anyone.
Hopefully all those involved (his friends, those that helped out and anybody else who saw it) take away some valuable info from this.
Really thoughtful write up by ranger.

"wake up call" is right.
I was getting ready to leave to head up but now I'm questioning it.

[RR]

Jeff's report says all that can be said.

He didn't say don't go to the Ravine. He did say to bring good judgement.

[gpetrics]

Holy wow. So scary. Just put it up on FIS to get the word out and keep people thinking.

[Panchito]

The thing that gets me is if he landed, there would have been cheers and hooting and hollering, perpetuating the risks
Glad he's okay

[Dan9]

*sigh* worth reading the whole thing, that is really incredible that dude is not dead.

[melikeskiing]

Saw the same thing on a smaller scale at the top of the left gully yesterday. As I was hiking up a guy cut up the wall skiers left and fell into a small hole up to his shoulders. With yesterdays high temps you had to be heads up...

[Harkin Banks]

That guy was WAY too lucky. He HAD to have had help from the ghosts of Dr. Paul Schiller and Cheryl Weingarten.

[boardman]

That guy was WAY too lucky. He HAD to have had help from the ghosts of Dr. Paul Schiller and Cheryl Weingarten.

unreal.

really bumming that I didn't get up there on Thurs or Fri before the onslaught. Hope something up there survives this weekend.

[Seeker]

BG told us about this, but just now reading up on it. Amazing how lucky this guy was. I do hope he really does "get it."

Really great write up. Lots of wisdom there.

[skimtwashington]

Good knowledge on the history of of this type of accident, H.B!

That guy was WAY too lucky. He HAD to have had help from the ghosts of Dr. Paul Schiller and Cheryl Weingarten.

Also big cheers for bystanders who put themselves at risk to rescue him before the patrol got there.

[Seeker]

Good knowledge on the history of of this type of accident, H.B!



Also big cheers for bystanders who put themselves at risk to rescue him before the patrol got there.


I actually thought the write up made a good point about this. First rule of S&R, take care of yourself. Not clear the folks who helped him out knew enough to be mindful of this. Not that I am criticizing in any way!

[skimtwashington]

First rule of S&R, take care of yourself.

I think sometimes a true hero is one who ignores the risk to themselves to help someone

.....although in this case he was not in (yet) a critical way..... just waiting down on a shelf, wet and maybe cold... slightly bruised(?)... but you know what I'm saying.

[riverc0il]

The problem of being a hero in S&R is that you could take a resque situation involving only one person and multiply it very quickly if the resquers do not take care of themselves. Not performing a resque well could actually make more work for S&R and put more people in greater risk. Not criticising those that did so as the result turned out well. But if more people fell in, we would be having a completely different conversation.

[boardman]

The problem of being a hero in S&R is that you could take a resque situation involving only one person and multiply it very quickly if the resquers do not take care of themselves. Not performing a resque well could actually make more work for S&R and put more people in greater risk. Not criticising those that did so as the result turned out well. But if more people fell in, we would be having a completely different conversation.

Exactly right.

[gradyboy]

We got up there Sat morning and took over the lean-to from the group that pulled him out. They advised of having caught it on video and I just located it on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntsXogwnBYE

Or just search on youtube for "tuckerman eats man"

The few guys that came down the same spot on Sat, though none fell in, were just as lucky.

[skimtwashington]

I understand the original point. S&R involves self preservation first.

It's just hard to not do something when someone is in trouble. I understand you can multiply the situation, of course. Most rescuer's are putting themselves 'out there' with some degree of risk. It might be selfish in an ironic way, to ignore the possibility or probability of multiplying the situation of entrapment, injury, or death- by trying to help in unsafe(for rescuers) conditions.

Ideally, you try to set up the safest rescue situation. But some situations, obviously are much higher risk for rescuers. The thought of leaving someone to die,time running out, will push, as history shows, someone to take great risk.

At the same time no one will chastise someone for not rescuing someone in time or effort that puts them at tremendous risk(S&R protocol).

This WAS NOT that dire situation. The snowboarder in the incident was lucky he was not really injured and seemed in no immediate danger-by the report. There seemed to be some time to be able to wait for the 'official'( Ski Patrol, NFS) rescue team. We hope the bystanders were experienced mountaineers with proper rescue techniques being used. The report seems unclear...maybe more will be learned later.

If it's not a stranger, but a friend, son, sibling or spouse- think how much you might be willing to risk regardless ,if time was running out. Again -this was not that situation. But interesting to think about.

Panchito's:
The thing that gets me is if he landed, there would have been cheers and hooting and hollering, perpetuating the risks
Glad he's okay
is a good point and likely true

[bucksaw]

Surf... I think we saw you go off the summit or Roe on Saturday.

Nice day Eh?

[surf88]

Sorry about the hijack, glad everyone who hiked up the TRT returned home this weekend.

[coreyb]

can the report be read anywhere? it was posted on the weekend update page which has since refreshed. i wasn't around internet this weekend and just catching up now...


edit: found it on a cached page: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:RYJcUfbcAyAJ:www.tuckerman.org/weekend.asp+april+2+tuckermans+ravine+crevasse&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a

One man's lucky day April 2 2010, 06:44 pm
At about 3pm Friday, a snowboarder was setting up for a run down the Headwall. He and his group had scoped out the line from below. It was over the smaller of the two waterfalls just beside the Lip. They’d done this line at least once before in prior years. He rode down through the bushes that marked the entrance to the line they wanted to drop. His brother was just above him, also going for the line, and another friend was out in the actual Lip. His girlfriend was watching from Lunch Rocks. The turns were all planned out in advance, unfortunately the plan didn’t work out right. He lost his heel edge in the snow and ice just above the rocky waterfall, and slid on his backside right down the waterfall, ending up about 20-25 feet deep inside a crevasse, with icy water cascading over his head. Fortunately he was uninjured, but nevertheless he was stuck inside a narrow crevasse. He climbed up a couple feet to a small rocky edge, put up his hood to fend off the spray of water, and waited.

I could have written this paragraph years ago, knowing that the potential for something like this to happen certainly existed, but I don’t write fiction. The incident did actually happen today, and we’re all very happy with the ending to the story. Numerous bystanders witnessed the incident and mobilized to help out in any way they could. About 15 minutes after it happened, word made it down to the Snow Ranger cabin. We were packed up and out the door quickly geared up for a full-on technical rescue. In the time it took us to get word of the incident, pack, and get up to the bowl the bystanders had pulled the snowboarder and his board up out of the hole and had lowered him down the Headwall to Lunch Rocks where I met up with him. He was cold, but otherwise uninjured. We gathered the story while he put on dry clothes, then it was over. I’ve seen a lot of accidents over the years here. I will honestly tell you he’s one of the luckiest people I’ve ever met.

It would be too easy to blame the snowboarder for choosing a route with hazards like falling into the waterfall. The problem with that solution is that it ignores the fact that we see people doing things almost every day throughout the winter that someone else could call a stupid idea and they end up just fine. If you spend enough as much time up here as we do watching people’s actions, you see that frequently accidents happen to good people, doing good things, and making good choices—an accident. But far more often you’ll see unprepared or uninformed people make what could be called poor decisions and they walk away unscathed. So what’s going on???

Here’s how I see it…we all have different tolerance for risks, so what one person thinks is a stupid idea might be completely reasonable to someone else. It’s up to each individual who comes to play in the mountains to make their own decisions, but in order to do that one must be able to evaluate and understand the risks he or she is taking. Truly understanding the risk is the most difficult thing to do. Does it take the personal experience of falling into an icy waterfall crevasse and waiting for help to come for someone to understand the magnitude of the risk? I hope not, since there are better ways to come to the same conclusion. One way would be to spend 5 days a week in the mountains for years on end. If that’s not practical, another way would be to listen to the information and advice offered by those who can and do spend that much time in the mountains.

This is where we come in. Every day since late November of last year a Snow Ranger has been on Mt. Washington, collecting and analyzing information, and putting it out there for anyone in the world to see, as long as they are receptive to it. This has been happening for more years than I’ve been alive. One theme that’s been taught to me from my start working here, and is reinforced every year, is that each year is different. Conditions are always changing, especially during spells of weather such as the past few days. The usual springtime hazards have erupted this past week, and the fact that we had someone today get incredibly lucky falling into the waterfall is a sign of the times. Every year, we highlight the same springtime hazards: avalanches, rock and icefall, crevasses, undermined snow, and bad weather. The important thing to remember is that although these tend to stay the same, the conditions that create them are very dynamic. It’s our jobs to give you information so that you can make good decisions in the mountains, so that you can safely enjoy your day, and so that you can come back again another day. We spend as much time as we do up here so that we can give you good information. Don’t hesitate to use us, the Volunteer Ski Patrol, or the AMC caretakers as sources for information.

I think at this point I feel compelled to add some judgment to the story. Was the snowboarder’s line a good choice of route? No, the risk of serious injury or death was far too great, especially considering what other options exist that don’t carry nearly as much risk. Was he lucky? You bet. Many people who have gone deep into the waterfall hole come out either seriously injured or dead. He’s lucky others were able to get to him quickly and get him out. Do I think the bystanders did the right thing? Yes and no. Yes in that they got him out without anyone else getting hurt, but no in that I’d bet not many of them seriously considered the importance of their own safety. At one point there were about 20 people in very close proximity to the edge of the crevasse (the edges are often undercut more than you’d expect.) With that said, I would like to publicly thank each and every person who helped out in this incident, especially Craig and Doug, two people who were quickly on scene with technical rescue and medical skills. As I look back on it, I see someone who made a poor choice of route involving excessive risk then had the rare experience of fully learning what the risk was while having minimal consequences and walking away from it. From talking with him, I think he now “gets it” and he’s very thankful of everyone’s efforts to help him out.

Thanks for understanding. If you’ve made it this far, the least I can do is give you some conditions information. I posted pictures on our website early this afternoon, but look at them knowing that the snowpack got hammered by skiers in the time between when I took the photos and the end of the day. I’m not expecting much of a freeze-up overnight. Maybe some radiational cooling will put a skim coat of crust on the surface, but it probably won’t lock up hard. That means that the deep mush will get deeper tomorrow. Sluff runnels are beginning to show in lots of areas, especially the Headwall and Lip. It’s going to be hot tomorrow again, so crevasses will be more open than they were today, icefall will be more of a hazard, undermining will continue, etc. The one thing I’m not going to be terribly worried about is the avalanche hazard. Bring extra water bottles, bring sunscreen, bring a hat and sunglasses. Bring an open mind and good judgment. And please, don’t try to ski the Headwall.

Also, don’t block the entrance to Pinkham with your vehicle. Park in the overflow lot if the main lot is full. Two weeks ago the State Police were issuing tickets for vehicles illegally parked.

Jeff

[Dan9]

on the recent pics page you can see all the disturbed snow near the edge of the crevasse from the throngs of people who went to the edge to peek and help.

not sure what I would do if I didn't have any rope or crevasse experience -- probably try and find soemone who did, maybe get close enough to be able to yell at the guy to reassure him I don't know.